Hello Again Quazi and Saijah,
As I mentioned earlier, thank you for your further inquiry. It's good of you to add thoughtful comments to the site. Thanks also for waiting for this reply. It wasn't until late this afternoon that I was able to sit down to the computer.
In your comment above, you wrote, "I do like your idea of building self-sufficient communities...." For the sake of other readers, who may not have read as much of the site and plan as the two of you may have, when you or we use the term "self-sufficient," we are using it within the understanding that all provisioning comes from God. Also, when the Real Liberal Christian Church uses the term, we also mean in conjunction with the concept of environmental sustainability and overall good-stewardship of the land, etc. We believe (we know) that good stewarding and good shepherding go hand-in-hand. If we can't take care of the small things such as the Earth, how are we going to take care of the universe? We take this from the parables of Jesus.
Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds. And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities. Luke 19:16-17.
We view good stewardship as doing the Golden Rule. We don't abuse the commons, because of the spirit of mercy, compassion, sympathy, and empathy. We care about others who also have to take their sustenance for the flesh from that given source. God didn't intend it for just those willing to push others out of the way to take over. That behavior is ungodly.
That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. Matthew 5:45. God is the real benefactor. God is the ultimate source. Those who don't see this and don't give God credit have their emotions way too hardened up. They have been burned and are so afraid of fire again, so consumed with self-preservation and the like, that they just are willing to let the half-dead soul lie by the side of the road while they cross to the other side so as to not get to close. Getting close might increase their sense of compassion and that must be avoided for selfishness' sake.
It's a difficult habit to break (being self-centered). It's conditioned, into Americans especially, from birth. Americans teach each other to think of themselves first and foremost. It's satanic.
You mentioned that you "believe the term you [the Church] are looking for is communal, not commune-ism." This raises a consistent theme of Isaiah/Jesus-Liberal Theology. The term communism underwent pejoration in which words become negative or less elevated through misuse.
The rich worked it so that all things cooperative would be associated with Marx, Lenin, and Stalin, et al. What we are in the process of doing is breaking that spell head on. Cooperation is better than competition. Communal is the adjective of commune.
In Arizona for instance, husbands and wives share everything as communal property. Their estates gained during the marriage (with some qualifications) are by state law communes. If they own a home, it's part of the family commune. This is very egalitarian concerning males and females when compared to other states.
If you do a search on our site for "pejoration," you may read more about this theme.
You said: "To love as Jesus is the right path. It leads to salvation."
Permit me to expand on your comment, and let me know if you agree.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Paul said, "not of yourselves"; however, Jesus said, Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. Matthew 12:33. In context, "fruit" here means results. It means results of behavior. Righteous behavior begets righteous results. If the results are evil, the means were evil. We are what we do. We are our works and our deeds. We are what we feel, say, and do. This means that we are chosen at the exact moment we choose. God chooses us as we turn to God. God's will and our will come closer. For Jesus, they were one. He taught his disciples this: To also become part of the One.
The main theme of Real Liberal Christianity is that since Jesus left, the powers that be have strived mightily to make the world an unenlightened (dark, ignorant) place. One of the main tools they've used is Paul's Epistles. The Devil can and does quote scripture, and he just loves quoting Paul more than quoting anyone else. He has used Paul's letters to justify war and capital punishment and discrimination against women and the list goes on and on. These particular verses (Ephesians 2:8-10) have been used to justify (really rationalize) not bringing forth the fruits worthy of repentance.
Works are requisite. Feed my lambs, he said. He also said, Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season? Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods. Matthew 24:45-47.
One may think he or she has all the faith in the world, but if he or she doesn't even try to bring forth, what's the truth about the spirit of that one? Is he or she of God?
Now many people ignore "unto good works...that we should walk in them." Even as they use Paul to excuse themselves, their eyes gloss over as they see those words, for those words mean good works are required and they might have to otherwise acknowledge that they are to give and share until everyone has enough rather than continuing to increase and hoard their excess.
I trust you agree.
Jesus Christ paid the price for our sins with His Blood so that we may have communion with God; it is by faith, believing that Jesus' sacrifice was sufficient in our place, that we receive grace. God never says "clean up your act, and then come see me." He says rather "Welcome Home, your sins are forgiven. Now go and sin no more."
Jesus paid for humanity's extended opportunity to make amends to each other under a new covenant for the new nation, spiritual nation (not small DNA-based tribe) bringing forth (by doing deeds that will bear only the good fruit in the end) and be persecuted and martyred for it by the selfish in their frenzied attempt, since real love will lead to their no longer being able to fool the people. We will continue though despite horrible and evil treatment. What Jesus started will take over, all the remnant of Abraham will joyfully convert, and the world will be righted.
Those who have the full opportunity to accept the word but who reject it nevertheless will end up in the lake of fire. We cannot go to God unclean. Even before Jesus ascended, he said touch me not. "Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father.... Luke 11:46.
He also taught, So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests. And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment: And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. For many are called, but few are chosen. Matthew 22:10-14.
At the same time, anyone is free to begin the cleaning process who begins. That's Jesus's message. It's criticized as being tautological in the pejorated sense by the ignorant and arrogant who think they know logic but find the clear and plain abstract.
His blood will clean, but being as those who were gathered at the feeding of the five thousand is not the same thing as attending a U.S. megachurch headed up by a neocon. In very truth, they are opposites. His blood doesn't clean those who don't have a burning desire to do his commandment for the right reason: For righteousness' sake.
It is important that we not operate under any illusions about the endless hairsplitting theological debates that have gone on down through the ages. The question of how many angels can dance on the head of a pin is a complete distraction from the task at hand to the point of insanity. If everyone on Earth calling himself or herself Christian were to stand on the principle of sola gratia and also stand around watching all the atheists actually doing all the deeds Jesus called for, the atheists would go into heaven before those calling themselves Christians. But what think ye? A certain man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to day in my vineyard. He answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented, and went. And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not. Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They say unto him, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you. Matthew 21:28-31.
Everything is by the grace of God. Every breath, every beat of the heart, every morsel of food, every drop of water is by the grace of God. No one can turn to God without knowing that, because anyone trying won't know which way to turn otherwise. No one can do anything without God. No atheist exists without God, even though the atheist doesn't know it. He's blind. He's spiritually blind. He can't see what we see. He doesn't feel the spirit moving him. He doesn't know from whenst his conscience and consciousness come or why they fail. He is a materialist. We know though that God manifested by transcendent, divine will all the matter of the universe.
Of course, the atheists aren't going to do all the things Jesus called for, because to do so requires the softness of heart to do it. Anyone with a soft enough heart is going to love Jesus and believe him. That's just the way of it.
The atheists don't experience the things that defy their notion of coincidence. They don't experience synchronicity for instance. They don't see the patterns in spiritual behavior as Jesus has expressed them to us. Of course, most of the Pharisees didn't see them either. They don't know they are possessed of the evil spirit. It's why we had all the lies leading up to the invasion of Baghdad. It's why we have all the lies now leading up to an horrific, fiendish, diabolical bombing of Iran designed to shock, abuse, and fracture the people into a stupor to be divided and further conquered by evil. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. John 8:44.
I'm going to give you much to digest here that is totally non-traditional teaching. Remember, the traditional teaching has led to U.S. Marines over in Iraq praying before they go out to maim and kill and be maimed and die for the sake of the imperial ambitions of the prince of this world—the exact same spirit that spiked our beloved brother Jesus to the cross to die a torturous, sadistic death.
He said, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. Matthew 16:24.
The cross is atoning. We are to take up our crosses. We are to atone. We are to be sacrificial for the sake's of our friends who are those who know and love the truth when they hear it that unselfishness is better than selfishness and perfect unselfishness is God.
The following verse is the most important part of the death of Jesus Christ:
"But God commends His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him."
...wisdom is justified of her children. Matthew 11:19. Her children are the fruits (results) of her behavior. Jesus bought humanity time by willingly being the ransom paid to the Devil who is death.
Satan is the accuser of human nature. Satan says human beings are inherently unworthy, can never overcome, and deserve to be tortured and annihilated. Satan goes about to prove that, by doing everything in his power to trip up human souls and to then point to the fallen as proof of his point.
Jesus knows better. Jesus knows there are human souls that are simply lost who will turn, repent, and atone, bringing forth proof of their worthiness, justifying them in the eyes of God. Jesus came and proved it. Jesus beat Satan on the cross. Jesus's love was so vast for righteousness that death could not collect the ransom even though it was paid. It is the most amazing thing in the existence of humankind. Jesus was the Real.
The following verses show what is the most important part of Jesus' resurrection: So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. But thanks be to God, which gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. (1Co 15:54-57)
Paul is showing some real insight here. The law here is the mundane law. It is coercive law. The real law is the law written on every heart. The real law is the divine law that is the spirit of the law. It is the real love the Jesus showed by going to the cross in absolute faith even though he agonized over it to the point of sweating blood. His strength, the same strength he wants to see in us, saw him through his second baptism.
But Jesus answered and said, Ye know not what ye ask. Are ye able to drink of the cup that I shall drink of, and to be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with? They say unto him, We are able. And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father. Matthew 20:22-23
This is the baptism of fire about which John the Baptist was talking. "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire." Matthew 3:11.
Now that we have the cleansing and forgiveness to put us in right relationship to the Heavenly Father, AND we now have the power over sin, death and the grave, the Holy Spirit can live in us. To love as Jesus loves is the right path, but we have to surrender to Him first and ask for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit before we can love with the limit-less love of GOD.
To love as Jesus loves is to be one with Jesus, God, and the Holy Spirit and all others who believe likewise and who act accordingly. It is all simultaneous. The spirit lives within and we come out from the spirit. We are spirit and the Spirit if we will but believe it. This is where Islam for instance is far, far from Christianity.
Muslims are taught to be standoffish about the spiritual family. Jesus taught that God is our Father. We are family. We are the sons and daughters of God. Jesus said that we should behave accordingly by doing righteous deeds toward our fellow human beings so they will know who we are and that we came out from God and are shining the light of that truth that is proved by our works through God.
Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven. Matthew 5:16. Where are our "good works"? We need the Christian Commons Project brought forth to fruition.
We are not to be ravening wolves on the inside or be workers of iniquity. We are to become consistent through-and-through.
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. Matthew 16:27.
...the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. John 5:36.
...believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. John 10:38.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father. John 14:12;15:24.
So, where are our works? Where are the works of the churches? Where is the evidence of the Holy Spirit dwelling within? Where is the justification for claiming salvation? Where are the deeds that fit with faith? We leave ourselves open to the accusations of Satan.
There is a false-Christianity all over the land. It is a twisted version of what Jesus taught and did. It conveniently emphasizes that which gives comfort to those who grab and hoard and kill and torture and lie.
If people calling themselves Christians won't be gathered together in the Holy Spirit of truth to do what Jesus said to do, where is their faith? Is it dead? Are they Christians?
"And hope makes not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us." (Rom 5:5)
1Co 15:1-6 Is a wonderful statement of the Gospel of Jesus Christ
I hope you can understand my zeal with this particular issue considering how fundamental the salvation message is.
Zeal is wonderful. For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt. Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another. Mark 9:49-50. We just need zeal for the right things. The militants have great zeal, but it's all for the wrong cause.
Dear Quazi and Saijah, I trust you understand that since this is a public blog that what we are saying here is meant for the many. This message is saying that the churches have been fabricating excuses for century after century. If they are going to be Christians, then let us all come together to feed the lambs. If they refuse, then let them call themselves something other than Christian.
You wrote about the current class structure as being diametrically opposed to Jesus' message. Help me understand how you expect to displace the current class structure if not everyone is onboard with your plan? Did you expect for this to be only for the Christians that follow you, or were you planning for this to spread to other parts of the Body? Are you proposing for this plan to encompass the non-Christians as well?
Let me preface here that when you write "follow you," let everyone understand that we are each and all to serve each and all. In so doing, we become one. We become one with God. Being of one heart and one soul means righteousness is our bond.
The only message we are to spread is Christian. Jesus's New Commandment (with all that it implies, given Jesus's words and living example) is the one and only way. Everyone hasn't been exposed to the message. There are those who have been properly exposed, still reject Jesus and God, and according to Jesus, will keep rejecting him right up to the end of their fleshly lives. Anyone who hates the idea of doing what Jesus said, which the first Apostles worked to do, namely live with all things held in common and look after (remember) the poor, is not of the Body, by definition. They are dead of the spirit of mercy. They want others to be sacrificed in their place, the way Caiaphas used Jesus. It is written as follows:
If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation. And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all, Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not. John 11:48-50
He made Jesus the sacrificial lamb and scapegoat in one. Jesus died for their sins, but things had changed. If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin. He that hateth me hateth my Father also. If I had not done among them the works which none other man did, they had not had sin: but now have they both seen and hated both me and my Father. John 15:22-24. The Pharisaic (hypocritical) animal sacrifices had made God sick long ago. "To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I am full of the burnt offerings of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats." Isaiah 1:11. Therefore, their human sacrifice of Jesus was an abomination beyond measure. It only served to compound the proof of the wickedness and irredeemability (at that point) of their souls. They are dead now. They are not, as Paul would say, asleep in Christ.
Specifically, we are going to be doing what will eventually displace the class structure. The class structure is already displaced wherever two or three are gathered together in the name of Yah Saves the Anointed One. For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them. Matthew 18:20. We will be increasing it. It will spread until tribulation brought on by iniquity. Then it will be well remembered afterwards as the only way to behave. That will be the start of the proverbial Millennium.
At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you: For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God. John 16:26-27.
Here's the most problematic verse for the naysayers who want Godliness to be unapproachable. Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you. John 15:15.
You mentioned that "...people have yet to make that leap of faith that really isn't a leap of faith but rather certain (absolute) knowledge that doing this is the right thing." In a world that has moved towards right and wrong being a relative thing, what is the authority declaring that this is the right thing?
In that world, there is no authority but self apart from God, which is death. That world will be burned away. The meek will inherit the Earth, and it will heal, be made whole, one with Heaven, new, just as one is born again.
"We are to be harmless while we are to feed his lambs and sheep (those who hear his voice) even while returning good for evil". Is this to say that we are to feed only those that hear Jesus' voice, and if so, how do we know who is who?
We are to feed his lambs and sheep while we do the other things as well, but we are to feed his lambs and sheep. Those who hear his voice will do as those who heard his voice when he walked the Earth. And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. John 10:16.
That's how you know them. You know them, because when they are called, they come and follow and do what he asks. The rest are not the lost of the fold. They were never of the real fold. They made of themselves the fold of the dead one forever who will be and has been vanquished by righteousness who is God our Father.
If you would be so kind as to permit me one more question, it would be about your statement:
"Consistency into the infinitude of God is the right path."
What exactly are you saying here?
Thank you for your time and consideration of my questions.
May our Father in Heaven draw you ever nearer to Himself.
Quazi and Saijah
Inconsistency is hypocrisy. When Jesus said, How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees? "Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees," Matthew 16:11-12, which Luke 12:1 explains "is hypocrisy."
Jesus is the master of speaking the figurative language of the revelation. He opens up the connotations of terms as no one else of whom we are aware. It is from this approach that we may begin to read and speak and do the real word.
The hypocrites who don't have the faith to give up their vast personal wealth hate this. But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. Matthew 23:13.
As you know, Jesus railed against hypocrisy. The less hypocritical we are the closer to the Kingdom we are. Of course the reverse is also true. The more hypocritical we are the farther or further or both we are from the Kingdom. God is infinite just as the decimals in pi never repeat. That's not irrational. It's completely rational. It is simply that people won't grasp it.
God is perfect. God is the absolute absence of hypocrisy. God is infinitely consistent. God's logic and reasoning are divine. Jesus got it. He took the sublime and showed it plainly and clearly.
However, the word still hasn't been preached to the whole world and in every language. It must be and will be. The prophecy must be fulfilled. The story must continue unfolding from the Climax that was Jesus's finishing it on the cross. "...he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost." John 19:30.
You asked excellent questions: Germane and highly salient.
The following should appear at the end of every post:
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Factors in determining whether a communication results in political campaign intervention include the following:
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Many religious organizations believe, as we do, that the above constitutes a violation of the First Amendment of the US Constitution.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
That said, we make the following absolutely clear here:
- The Real Liberal Christian Church and Christian Commons Project not only do not endorse any candidate for any secular office, we say that Christianity forbids voting in such elections.
- Furthermore, when we discuss any public-office holder's position, policy, action or inaction, we definitely are not encouraging anyone to vote for that office holder's position.
- We are not trying to influence secular elections but rather want people to come out from that entire fallen system.
- When we analyze or discuss what is termed "public policy," we do it entirely from a theological standpoint with an eye to educating professing Christians and those to whom we are openly always proselytizing to convert to authentic Christianity.
- It is impossible for us to fully evangelize and proselytize without directly discussing the pros and cons of public policy and the positions of secular-office holders, hence the unconstitutionality of the IRS code on the matter.
- We are not rich and wouldn't be looking for a fight regardless. What we cannot do is compromise our faith (which seeks to harm nobody, quite the contrary).
- We render unto Caesar what is Caesar's. We render unto God what is God's.
- When Caesar says to us that unless we shut up about the unrighteousness of Caesar's policies and practices, we will lose the ability of people who donate to us to declare their donations as deductions on their federal and state income-tax returns, we say to Caesar that we cannot shut up while exercising our religion in a very reasonable way.
- We consider the IRS code on this matter as deliberate economic duress (a form of coercion) and a direct attempt by the federal government to censor dissenting, free political and religious speech.
- It's not freedom of religion if they tax it.
And when they were come to Capernaum, they that received tribute money came to Peter, and said, Doth not your master pay tribute? He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers? Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free. (Matthew 17:24-26)